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Thread: Denethor

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Having just seen Rotk, i wonder if anyone else thought that Denethor looked too much like Grima Wormtongue. Of all the charcters in the films,Denethor was the one whose portrayal by PJ I disliked the most. I thought he would have been portrayed as a man gone mad with power and grief, and the knowledge he had of what was about to happen. Instead he just appeared as a mad man who, cared nothing about anything.
I never thought of Denethor being like Grima, but they are both sniveling gloomy men.

I think that PJ probably cut out a lot of the Denethor bits from the movie that would have expanded him as a character.
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I think that PJ probably cut out a lot of the Denethor bits from the movie that would have expanded him as a character.

I understand that PJ had to cut a great deal from ROTK because the finished product was almost an hour too long for NewLIne's requirements. I suspect that we will see more of Denethor's character development in the extended version.
Denethor did go mad but it was the visions he saw through the palantir that caused him to believe there was no hope left and like Sauron, believed the hobbit with the Ring had been captured. This hopelessness caused his madness, not his lust for power. Unlike Grima, who believed he would reap great rewards by working for Saruman.
I thought the movie Denethor had no reason to be so biased and almost insane, which is why he's so hated. If it was potrayed that he knows Faramir let the One Ring go, at least it would explain some of his bitterness instead of just being angry that Aragorn is coming to Gondor.
Welcome to PT Eldomeldo, hope you enjoy it here! Personally, I didnít think Denethor looked too much like Grima, and I thought John Noble looked perfect for the part, but I was very disappointed with how his character was portrayed in the film. Denethorís real character hardly came through at all (save for a couple of moments), and he just came off as some sort of a bumbling idiot.

I felt kind of sorry for the people in the audience who have never read the books, because theyíll never understand why, and how he became the way he was. That was obviously completely lost in the theatrical cut of the film. IMHO, the three characters that got the short end of the stick in PJís films are Denethor, Faramir, and Elrond. They really screwed those characters up, and missed the mark, but I do think that PJ and Co. did a pretty decent job with the majority of the characters in all three films.

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I understand that PJ had to cut a great deal from ROTK because the finished product was almost an hour too long for NewLIne's requirements. I suspect that we will see more of Denethor's character development in the extended version.


Youíre quite right about that Nell. About 2 weeks before ROTK came out, I was reading an interview with one of the film editors, and he said that the original cut of the film was 4 hours, and 35 minutes. Then about two days later, I was reading an interview with PJ, and he said that there had been an hour, and 5 minutes of ďfinished footageĒ cut from the film. PJ then went on to say in the same interview that at least half of that footage would find itís way back into the extended cut. Then in an interview with some Danish mag I saw translated a few days later, PJ said something about the extended version being 4 hours, and 15 minutes long, which obviously would mean that weíre going to get most of that footage back.

I too remain hopeful that weíll see more character development for Denethor in the SEE cut of ROTK, and Iím also hopeful that when itís all said and done, the SEE version of ROTK will be the best of the bunch.
Elf Smilie
All I can say about Denethor in the film, is that I thought John Noble played him very well. However 2 things I was unsure of. Firstly, when Gandalf hits him with the staff after he has cried out that the guard should flee was too comic for me. Secondly, he runs an awful long way for somebody who is burning to death. I preferred the way of the book with Gandalf watching the burning room, not watching Denethor running. His line, "and now passes Denethor" just doesn't quite seem to fit.

This said, in the extended Two Towers, John Noble's deleted scene embodies 100% of how I imagined him.
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However 2 things I was unsure of. Firstly, when Gandalf hits him with the staff after he has cried out that the guard should flee was too comic for me. Secondly, he runs an awful long way for somebody who is burning to death. I preferred the way of the book with Gandalf watching the burning room, not watching Denethor running. His line, "and now passes Denethor" just doesn't quite seem to fit.


I totally agree Jorus, and welcome to PT btw, itís nice to see so many new people around. Personally I hated the bit where Gandalf cracks Denethor over the head with his staff. I found that bit to be totally demeaning to both Gandalf, and Denethorís characters, and letís face it; it was just way out of character for Gandalf. Tolkienís Gandalf would have never done something like that.

The bit where Denethor runs to his death while burning didnít really bother me that much, but again, I agree with you, I much prefer how it is in the book.
Elf Smilie