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Thread: Help wanted LT 1 and 2

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Is it worth reading these as they seem to be a rough draft of Silmarillion? If im not missing anything too important , i'd like to skip to 'Lays of the Belerriand'.

Any advice?
Personally, I skipped all the way to Book 10, Morgoth's Ring and Book 11, The War of the Jewels.

The whole of the HOME series is a chronicle of Tolkien's evolution of the stories in the Silmarillion and Lord of the Rings. Lost Tales contains some of the earliest drafts of the Silmarillion, and as such some of the ideas and concepts are very different to the published stories in the book. As Morgoth's Ring and the later HOME books contain material written after he completed LotR, the material is fresher and less contradictory than the earlier HOME books such as LT.

I do feel as though you can jump about in HOME though, reading the bits of most interest first. In a way, I treat them as reference books rather than novels.

Hope that helps.
Thnaks, it does.

The titles in the HOME series pre 'Morgoths ring' also strike me as 'Silmarillionesque'.

When historically do books 10,11, and 12 take place ? post Frodo casting the ring into Mount Doom?

I don't think you should read the books of HOME that way. I think, if you want to know what happened in the fourth age, reading a story in Unfinished tales or reading Sauron Defeated would quench your thirst for more on that. There might be more, this is all coming from my memory.
i recommend reading LT1 and LT2 because i have them both and enjoyed them. Personally i think one of the best battles Tolkien ever rights, can only be found in LT. It's The Fall of Gondonlin, and it is very vague in every book, except for the LT. Although the facts might not be 100% correct because Tolkien's ideas have defently changed since he wrote it, but never the less, it's an amazing battle.

Quote:
When historically do books 10,11, and 12 take place ? post Frodo casting the ring into Mount Doom?


No they are still the Silmarillion, but just later drafts of the stories.
I think the best idea might be to read them myself, and find out what i am missing, or not as the case may be. Friends told me not to bother with Sil becuase it was dry, but i thought it was fantastic after i'd got my head around the 'creation' myth at the strat.

Any other comments or advice would be greatly appreciated.
If you haven't already read it, I'd suggest giving Unfinished Tales a go before moving on to HOME. Style-wise, it's kind of like a bridge between HOME and the Silmarillion.
ya i gotta agree with Val on that. Unfinished Tales fits would be the next logical read after The Silmarillion. It's written with a similar narrative form as the Silmarillion, and it also goes into detail on a few chapters that Silmarillion breifly goes over.
Am currently re-reading LT 1, and I have to say that it's more for the reader who is both well-versed already in Silmarillion (read it several times) and really wants to find other things to compare. Seeing the evolution from LT 1 and 2 to the stories in Silmarillion is fascinating for me, but I can definitely see where they would be hard to read without the desire being there. As for skipping to Lays, it (as well as all the other HOME books) is laid out and presented in the same way LT 1 and 2 are, so I guess read what you want to know about. Interesting though, to see things like what Meilan the Maia's original name was... (you'll have to read LT 1 to find out). ;-)
Lost Tales is pretty much seperate to The Sil proper. It was Tolkien's earliest attempts at writing a mythology for England, which he felt had been deprived of its own "English" myth. It is quite interesting meeting characters such as AElfwine who disappear once Tolkien's vision grew and he expanded his mythology during the 1930s.

However, there are some nice bits in them, if you can get around the (very) archaic language that Tolkien assumed for it.
I have to chime in my agreement with Turambar on the Fall of Gondolin (maybe it was fated) which was pert' neer awesome. Continuing my (and not to take anything away from) "[Your LotR event here] was but an echo of its epic counterpart in [parrallel Silmarillion event here]" them, Pellenor Fields (my favorite part of the Trilogy) pales in comparison to the LT version of the Fall of Gondolin (of course it's not a perfect parallel, since the outcomes were radically different, but I feel it's where both stories peaked.) As Turambar notes, there's noting approaching the LT level of detail about it in the Silmarillion, but, as I've elsewhere stated, I first turned to HoME in attempt to get the grander Silmarillin story I preferred in Trilogy detail, something I now realize will never happen and try not to think about. I'd do LT before UT, at least LT2, but then, I did, from necessity. That said, the four seminal events of the First Age, the union of Beren and Luthien and the epic surrouding it, the Fall of Gondolin, the slaying of Glaurung (had to throw that in given with whom I'm concurring,) and the voyage of Earendel are all in LT2 (completely forgot about the Nauglafring; I just dug out LT2 for a DISCUSSION for the first time and officially love the site now.) I may just have to reread that puppy now, and I haven't done that in a decade.

I have to say I was disappointed more in the lack of Silmarillion comprehensiveness in HoME, LT1&2 especially; my goal of getting an in depth story was fully satisfied in all the major events. It seems that, in general, I can have totality or depth, but I can't have both. Then there's the problem of reading LT1&2 on the heels of the Silmarilion so it's hard for me to remember which parts of which story come from where. At the end of the day, the Silmarillion appeals to the amateur historian in me; I LIKE the archaic language, and even did a fair job of imitating it for a short in HS about a quest to Angband after the War of the Powers for iron from Morgoths crown itself to "improve" the efficacy of Angainor. Wouldn't you know a stupid Balrog got in the way, and the rest, as they say, is history (much like the Balrog when Eonwe finished with it.)
I've just started reading The Book Of Lost Tales 2! Thanks for this Info. In Tolkien stories its like this Eriol>Aelfwine>? Why did Tolkien delete him? Elf Confused Smilie