What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

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pettytyrant101
Posts: 1383

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#1 » Fri Nov 19, 2010 4:37 pm

I was rereading TT. And in the chapter 'King of the Golden Hall', shortly after Gandalf does his besting of Wormtongue in the hall and then leads Theoden out into the sun, there is this passage;

'Quickly now Gandalf spoke. His voice was low and secret, and none save the king heard what he said. But ever as he spoke the light shone brighter in Theoden's eye, and at the last he rose from his seat to his full height, and Gandalf beside him, and together they looked out from the high place towards the east.
"Verily," said Gandalf, now in a loud voice, keen and clear,"that way lies our hope, where sits our greatest fear. Doom hangs still on a thread. Yet hope is still, if we can but stand unconquered for a little while."'


A few pages later, as Gandalf is explaining to Theoden why following Wormtongue's advice not to hunt orcs in the north would have been disastrous for all Gandalf says this;

'Not indeed that prize which Saruman desires above all else, but at the least two members of my Company, sharers of a secret hope, of which even to you, lord, I cannot speak openly."

So if he didn't tell Theoden about Frodo or the Ring in the first instance what did he tell him in a 'low and secret' voice?

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Gandalfs Beard
Posts: 2311

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#2 » Fri Nov 19, 2010 7:10 pm

pettytyrant101 wrote:I was rereading TT. And in the chapter 'King of the Golden Hall', shortly after Gandalf does his besting of Wormtongue in the hall and then leads Theoden out into the sun, there is this passage;

'Quickly now Gandalf spoke. His voice was low and secret, and none save the king heard what he said. But ever as he spoke the light shone brighter in Theoden's eye, and at the last he rose from his seat to his full height, and Gandalf beside him, and together they looked out from the high place towards the east.
"Verily," said Gandalf, now in a loud voice, keen and clear,"that way lies our hope, where sits our greatest fear. Doom hangs still on a thread. Yet hope is still, if we can but stand unconquered for a little while."'


A few pages later, as Gandalf is explaining to Theoden why following Wormtongue's advice not to hunt orcs in the north would have been disastrous for all Gandalf says this;

'Not indeed that prize which Saruman desires above all else, but at the least two members of my Company, sharers of a secret hope, of which even to you, lord, I cannot speak openly."

So if he didn't tell Theoden about Frodo or the Ring in the first instance what did he tell him in a 'low and secret' voice?


That the secret to all of reality is 42. ;)

GB

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chris63
Posts: 218

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#3 » Fri Nov 19, 2010 9:05 pm

You been watchin Hitchhikers guide to the Galaxy again [color=#008000]GB[/color]?

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chris63
Posts: 218

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#4 » Fri Nov 19, 2010 9:16 pm

Gandalf said. Theo where starving, can you make me and the lads a bacon butty :lol:

Jolly Cotton
Posts: 63

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#5 » Sat Nov 20, 2010 10:45 am

Tolkien was probably concerned that there wasn't enough vague topics and references in TT, and added some, because he knew people love things to discuss!

I think the reason is that he did reveal some information, that he didn't want any ears to hear, but the King. Gandalf though didn't reveal anything, i.e information about the ringbears, just the stuff about Galdadriel and the death of Boromir.

So when he says he can't speak openly, he means he cant speak openly on Frodo and Sam. But Gandalf didn't want to speak openly in the first instance because he still speaks potentially sensitive information.

There. Finished ad-libbing!

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pettytyrant101
Posts: 1383

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#6 » Sat Nov 20, 2010 1:09 pm

I'm not sure what he would have to tell Theoden about Galadriel. And Theoden would have known already about Boromir as Aragorn told Eomer about it earlier-"Your news is full of woe. He was a mighty man" or words to that effect (going from memory!) And Theoden seems clued up on everything Eomer was told by the time Gandalf and co arrive.

My own guess is that it had something to do with Saruman and what Saruman was up to. It may have been deemed safe enough by Gandalf to not mention the Ring directly but to put Theoden in the picture over Sarumans real, long term goals regarding 'Isildur's bane'. Just my guess though.

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Tinuviel
Posts: 474

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#7 » Sat Nov 20, 2010 4:25 pm

Perhaps it was about he Return of the King? Or the POSSIBLe return...

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pettytyrant101
Posts: 1383

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#8 » Sat Nov 20, 2010 8:39 pm

I'm not sure what you mean Tin? Do you mean just telling him about Aragorn and the plan for him to be King?

Theoden is already aware of who Aragorn is before he comes to Meduseld. Aragorn gives a full roll call of his lineage to Eomer when they meet and their names are given before entering the hall. So Theoden would have known who Aragorn was and his claim. So I'm not sure there would have been much more to say and Aragorn's claim is not a secret.

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Gandalfs Beard
Posts: 2311

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#9 » Sun Nov 21, 2010 5:03 am

pettytyrant101 wrote:"But ever as he spoke the light shone brighter in Theoden's eye,"

So if he didn't tell Theoden about Frodo or the Ring in the first instance what did he tell him in a 'low and secret' voice?


Either chanting a spell to snap Theoden out of it, or whispering "Sweet Nothings." ;)

GB

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Tinuviel
Posts: 474

What did Gandalf say to Theoden?

Post#10 » Sun Nov 21, 2010 4:24 pm

I don't know. It's Gandalf. Who EVER knows??? :roll: :lol:

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