Nothing out of turn, Allyssa. It's nice to have you on board with us. :)Well, those are my thoughts on the discussion. This is my first contribution to the reading group, so I appologise if it is out of turn. Feel free to delete me if I have not followed the rules.
I think he was already tainted; however, they all were overly pushing him for an answer, with the exception of Aule who knew how much went into any making. Then Feanor spoke, crying bitterly:3) Could there be any justification for Feanor refusing Yavanna the light from his Silmaril's to heal the Two Trees?
None, unless the Silmarils would have been destroyed in the process. This could make Feanor's reluctance understandable, since he crafted them and loved them. But it seems clear to me, that Feanor was already tainted or 'marred' by the words of Melkor.
The trees could only be made once and Feanor said likewise for the Silmarils. Aule would have felt the same way had the Iluvatar required his Dwarves to be unmade. For the light in the Silmarils to rejuvenate the trees, the jewels would have to be unmade. They were just asking too much. That Feanor brooded over this hard request instead of offering them up for the greater good, meant to me that Melkor's lies had already taken root; the stage was now set for the centuries/millennia of heartbreak that were to follow from his denial. :verysad:For the less even as for the greater there is some deed that he may accomplish but once only; and in that deed his heart shall rest. It may be that I can unlock my jewels, but never again shall I make their like; and if I must break them, I shall break my heart, and I shall be slain; first of all the Eldar in Aman.'
Think she was a creature similar to a lesser Valar who had been bent in the making like Melkor was. When he discovered her, he decided she would make him a good tool, but found later that her lusts were very difficult to control. She was more powerful than a mere Balrog, because it took many to just chase her away, even Melkor wasn't yet strong enough to take her on. It almost seems like she came from outside Eru's thought, which doesn't make sense unless there were others like Eru out there in the void, but I thought we had a monotheistic hierarchy here. :elfconfused:2) What sort of creature was Ungoliant? Was she created from the thought of Eru as the Ainur had been, or was she from outside of his thought?
4) Fingolfin did not wish to leave Valinor with Feanor. Why did he?
Until I read Grondy's post I was always of the thought that Ungoliant was a creature from outside of Eru's thought. I thought she was a creature Melkor had first discovered while he had gone into the Void in search of the Flame Imperishable, and there, he had bent her to his will.It almost seems like she came from outside Eru's thought, which doesn't make sense unless there were others like Eru out there in the void, but I thought we had a monotheistic hierarchy here.
I think Melkor saw they were weak willed, however, because he saw they burned with pride.
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