Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

The forthcoming Hobbit movie
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brego
Posts: 1275

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#1 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 12:01 am

After reading many posts on PT and other sites regarding a Zombie Orc called Azog, who was brought to life by the Necromancer of Dolguldur, I was pleasantly surprised upon seeing the film that there was no such character. Yes Azog is indeed in the Hobbit and yes in all of JRRT's written stories he was killed by Thorin in retribution for his Fathers Death, but obviously PJ decided to state that Azog indeed survived the onslaught of Thorin, and lived on in increasing hatred of the Dwarven Empire.
Interesting change by PJ as he obviously has set Azog up as the major protagonist, albeit possibly under Sauron, of the Dark/Evil side bent on stopping the company of Thorin

So what are your thoughts on this major narrative alteration?

Balrogs R Us
Posts: 539

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#2 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 1:09 am


Personally I thought it was ridiculous people thought he was some sort of zombie orc. Sounds like an internet joke that got out of hand.



I think Azog will die later and Bolg will become the character. Also, I think you meant antagonist. :p



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brego
Posts: 1275

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#3 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 1:59 am

That's probably true. Haha protagonist of terror maybe.

Faefillind Wanderer
Posts: 9

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#4 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:02 am


"Yes Azog is indeed in the Hobbit and yes in all of JRRT's written stories he was killed by Thorin in retribution for his Fathers Death, but obviously PJ decided to state that Azog indeed survived the onslaught of Thorin, and lived on in increasing hatred of the Dwarven Empire."



 



No. Azog was killed by Dain Ironfoot at the battle of Azanulbizar. The battle of Azanulbizar was the culmination of the War of the Dwarves and orcs, which was started by Thrain (thorin's father) after Azog killed Thror (Thorin's grandfather) when Thror traveled to Moria.



 



Thror goes to Moria



Azog kills thror



Thrain starts the war of the dwarves and orcs



Battle of Azanulbizar (some years later)



Azog kill Nain (Dain's father) by breaking his neck



Azog and co. begin to retreat back into Moria but Dain leaps out and kills Azog



 



Tolkien never wrote anything about Thorin battling Azog, nor killing him, and Thorin's father (Thrain) survived the battle of Azanulbizar and returned to the blue mountains in the west, only to be captured some years later by the forces of the necromancer and imprisoned in Dol Guldur where years following, Gandalf found him, didn't know who he was, and inherited the map and key to Erebor which he then gave to Thorin and thus the quest of Erebor.



 



Jackson took A LOT of liberties with the history and story here, changes which were unnecessary.



 



It is actually Azog's son, Bolg who leads the orcs in the battle of the five armies, but even then, Thorin does not kill Bolg, Beorn does after Bolg mortally wounds Thorin in battle.



 


feanor1999
Posts: 7

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#5 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:07 am


Ayup All...



TBH, I thought it was Ludicrous. TH is a great story on its own, and doesn't need the embellishment, IMO. the way the Dwarf/Goblin war was depicted outside the Gates of Moria was pure Amazing Visual Warhammer, and Quite awesome, but it would have had some real Impact if it had been shot as in the Book. It's just as exciting, if not more so, if you have Azogs Head spiked, with a Bg of Gold in his Mouth, LOL ! What's happened is, is PJ has shifted the emphasis in the film from Bilbo to Thorin, because in the book, all Thorin basically does is roll around Moaning and dissing Bilbo, even when Bilbo saves the dwarves time after time. Obviously the changes here are more for Cinematic effect, rather than anything else. How I feel about THAT, is, of course, a whole different Ball-Game, LOL. 



Faefillind Wanderer
Posts: 9

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#6 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:16 am


The only two parts of this film I found enjoyable or worth seeing were:



1) Erebor before the sacking. Absolutely beautiful, and as a big Dwarf enthusiast it was amazing to see it in its glory.



2) Riddles in the Dark scene up to and including the moment where Bilbo spares Gollum's life.  - despite it being watered down.



feanor1999
Posts: 7

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#7 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 6:36 am


Did you find TH too 'Cartoony' as I did ?



 


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brego
Posts: 1275

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#8 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 5:16 pm

Yes it was Thror of course who killed Azog in the books. Thanks Feanor.


I have a feeling there may be legal reasons leading to the change of character names. And correct the change seems silly. PJ and co have a lot of Tolkien historians working on the films so it couldn't just be an oversight. The original story is much more awesome and would be far better on film. It's does seem strange.


Re cartoony - it is a little, however so is the book, actually
more so than the film. I reckon that as the story goes on it will get darker and deeper. Well I hope so anyway.


Balrogs R Us
Posts: 539

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#9 » Sat Jan 05, 2013 9:45 pm


I think if you look at the history of epic action, you'll see that more likely than not Azog will die and Bolg, fueled by vengeance and power, will become the main bad guy for the final battle. Like the orc at the end of FOTR. I HIGHLY doubt Azog will be around till the third movie.



What's funny is I've asked around, and most people don't even know the name of the orc anyways, they just know him as the main bad guy of the movie. Only us Tolkien folk even thought twice about it. Which, of course, is awesome.



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brego
Posts: 1275

Azog - Zombie or Survivor?

Post#10 » Sun Jan 06, 2013 1:53 am

True Balrogs. Funny also that a lot of my friends who have never read Tolkien picked up the the white council scene was related to the events in TLOTR and that the Necro was indeed Sauron.


It's interesting to get the perspective of non Tolkien viewers. Also the link between the Firwork version of Smaug and the real thing at the end. Some even remembered the Sackville Bagins's!


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