Faramir

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grondmaster
Posts: 25451

Faramir

Post#1 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

My favorite Faramir bit is from 'The Two Towers', Book IV, Chapter 5 entitled 'Window on the West'
Sam hesitated for a moment, the bowing very low: 'Good night, Captain, my lord,' he said. 'You took the chance, sir.'

'Did I so?' said Faramir.

'Yes sir, and showed your quality: the very highest.'

Faramir smiled. 'A pert servant, Master Samwise. But nay: the praise of the praiseworthy is above all rewards. Yet there was naught in this to praise. I had no desire to do other than I have done.'

'Ah well, sir,' said Sam, 'you said my master had an elvish air; and that was good and true. But I can say this: you have an air too, sir, that reminds me of, of--well, Gandalf, of wizards.'

'Maybe,' said Faramir. 'Maybe you discern from far away the air of Numenor. Good night!'
'Share and enjoy'

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Allyssa
Posts: 1657

Faramir

Post#2 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

Faramir, Faramir, Faramir.....wasn't he just adorable? Eowyn wasn't even good enough for him! I have to envision more than one marital dissagreement with that couple.

I think the reason Faramir was like Gandalf is that he and the wizard were very close evidently. When Gandalf was in Gondor, Faramir used to like to spend time with him, and learn from him. This made Denethor very angry, and he even abused Faramir physically for it.

Gandalf seems to have responded to Faramir with paternal affection. I fancy Gandalf would have liked to adopt him! This is largly what dragged Gandalf away from the gates to rescue him. He just couldn't bare to let him die, no matter what the cost to the battle.

I totally agree with Ungoliant. Where do you get a man like that? *sigh*. I cant wait to see him in the movie! I hope they do him justice.
"May the Angels Guide"

swampfaye
Posts: 390

Faramir

Post#3 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

My favorite part is where Faramir tells his father he let the ring go and his father acts so disapointed. But Faramir didn't try to explain his way out of it, just accepted his father's ire like a real man! I can't wait for him on screen. He is my favorite human in the series.

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TomBombadillo
Posts: 2746

Faramir

Post#4 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

I didn't like Faramir. Am I alone? :) Well, I did like him, but not really. Guess he's just the brother of Boromir for me. :)
Denial is not a river in Africa.

Eryan
Posts: 845

Faramir

Post#5 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

It's great that so many of you like Faramir so much!
Yes - the description of his awakening to life is very moving. I also think that that scene has a very profound symbolic meaning. Faramir and Aragorn are still rivals - they both have lawful claims to rule Minas Tirith, Faramir as the Heir of Denethor, Aragorn as the Heir of Elendil himself. And Aragorn does not win by defeating Faramir (= demonstrating that Faramir is weaker, less worthy...) - but by healing him, by giving him new life. The righteous King is the Healer, the Giver of Life - and not of Death.
However, I felt a little bit disappointed by a brief account of the meeting between Aragorn and Faramir after Aragorn became the King; it was too much cold and formal for me. I expected that they will become personal friends... like Aragorn and Eomer. ..

As for the attitude of Denethor - I can understand it very well. Finally the choice of Faramir proved to be juistified - but it could very easily prove to be totally disastrous. Denethor was convinced that the quest of Frodo cannot succeed and that it will only hasten the moment, when the Ring will fall into the hands of the Enemy. And it's true alas what he said to Faramir, that he made his choice not only for himself, but also for his whole people, whom he should protect... without even asking them their opinion. Finally some of them could prefer thraldom (with the hope that it won't continue infinitely!...) to the ultimate destruction of Gondor.
In a way, both Denethor and Faramir were right. And it's this that makes their relationship tragic. Denethor was not simply a nasty dad unjust to his son! Ttheir confilnct reminds me of the confilct between Antigona and Creon in the classical Greek play of Sofocles...

swampfaye
Posts: 390

Faramir

Post#6 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

I think Denethor was indeed unjust to his son. He compared him to Boromir. As a mother of two sons I know this is the ultimate slap in the face! It indicates disapointment in the one son and the elevation of the other son at the same time.

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Allyssa
Posts: 1657

Faramir

Post#7 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

Denethor didn't just compare the two, he openly favoured Boromir. He even said to Faramir that he wished he had died instead. Don't you just hate Denethor?

All of this just made me love Faramir all the more, as no doubt Tolkien intended. Good parents love all their children equally.
"May the Angels Guide"

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PlasticSquirrel
Posts: 3577

Faramir

Post#8 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

I reckon Denethor was pretty unjust to his son when he tried to burn him alive. What do you reckon?
http://www.plasticsquirrel.co.uk for all your bizarre music and musings needs

Eryan
Posts: 845

Faramir

Post#9 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

Yes I agree that Denethor was not really an exemplary father. It was really cruel to tell Faramir that he preferred him to die instead of Boromir - nad all this when Faramir was nearly spent after hard fighting and not sleeping on several nights! But I think that he told him so mainly because he was frankly convinced that Faramir did an extremely stupid and disastrous thing by letting the Ring go to Mordor. He did not believe that Frodo had any chance of destroying the Ring. And we must admit that it WAS highly improbable! I think that this was just an expression of his anger.
For wishing to burn him alive... well he himself also choose to be burned alive. He just wanted to die (together with his son whom he loved after all and to whom he had guilty feelings) with some dignity... and not to be hewed into pieces or tormeted by victorious soldiers of Sauron. He saw himself in the Palantir black sails of corsairs of Umbar coming to join the hosts of Mordor, he had no idea that it's Aragorn coming to his aid.
Of course we are all on the side of Faramir, also because he behaves with so much class - is not aggressive himself but "takes it" as a man. Yet Denethor is a cmplex personality and not just a stupid old man, unjust and full of spite.
It is of course a very bad thing, to favorize one of the children. I personally had very wise parents; sometimes either I or my brother asked them "Whom do you love more?" they always answered " We love you both in the same way". We never ever got a different answer and we appreciate it!
However, look how that injust treatment worked in the case of Denethor's children. It's Boromir (the favorised one) who has apparently some problems with his personality. Boromir is anxious to be assured that everybody is "grateful" to him which means that he feels that he is not loved (or even not liked) enough. And no wonder, Faramir is generally liked because he is sensitive and understands others and respects their dignity - whereas Boromir is accustomed to "have his will" with everybody and do not bothers overmuch about their feelings. Remember his behaviour during the Council of Elrond - when old Bilbo made his valiant offer to become the Ring Bearer, Boromir started to laugh and "laughter died on his lips" only when he remarked that all others do not have any idea to laugh!
My point is that if you favorize one of your children you do harm to both of them, and not only to the child which is less praised. Spoiled children tend to be bullies and therefore they become unpopular and finally unhappy...

swampfaye
Posts: 390

Faramir

Post#10 » Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am

LOL, Squirrel, you have a way of getting right to the point don't you? Boromir was a little shallow in the book, admittedly, but he was first and formost trying to restore faith in his fathers rule (not an un noble or totally selfish act) and restore faith in men. The ring used these noble goals and twisted them when it called him. I really got tired of his "I told you so's" but you have to admit... he was right about everything but Frodo's chances in Mordor!

Faramir is one of the characters I really like, so I am really trying to not get my hopes up about the character on the movie. I don't want to be disapointed. But since they did such an excellent job on Sam (another one of my fav's) I will give them the benefit of the doubt until I see the movie. (I will have no expectations and will therefore not be disapointed...I will have no expectations and will therefore not be disapointed...I will have no expectations and will therefore not be disapointed... IT'S NOT WORKING)![Edited on 8/2/2002 by swampfaye]

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