Black Numenoreans

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Vee
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Black Numenoreans

Post#1 » Fri Sep 03, 2004 3:18 pm

Appendix A - RotK

A footnote....

The great cape and land-locked firth of Umbar had been Numenorean land since days of old; but it wa a stronghold of the King's Men, who were afterwrds called the Black Numenoreans, corrupted by Sauron, and who hated above all the followers of Elendil. After the fall of Sauron their race swiftly dwindled or became merged with the Men of Middle-earth, but they inherited without lessening their hatred of Gondor. Umbar, therefore, was only taken at great cost.


I like to think that after Sauron's defeat some of these Black Numenoreans enjoyed life beyond the Shadow and their ancestry and heritage (being similar to Aragorn's) came to the fore and they contributed to the Age of Men.

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valedhelgwath
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Black Numenoreans

Post#2 » Sat Sep 04, 2004 12:42 pm

I like to think that after Sauron's defeat some of these Black Numenoreans enjoyed life beyond the Shadow and their ancestry and heritage (being similar to Aragorn's) came to the fore and they contributed to the Age of Men.


Unfortunately, I don't think that this happened during Aragorn's days.

From Appendix A, RotK

.... and Eomer took again the Oath of Eorl. Often he fulfilled it. For though Sauron had passed, the hatreds and evils that he bred had not died, and the King of the West had many enemies to subdue before the White Tree could grow in peace. And wherever King Elessar went with war King Eomer went with him; and beyond the Sea of Rhun and on the far fields of the South the thunder of the cavalry of the Mark was heard, and the White Horse upon Green flew in many winds until Eomer grew old.


The fields of the South may just refer to Harad, but Umbar had long been allied to the Haradrim. It does show that the wars did not end with the fall of Sauron, however.

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grondmaster
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Black Numenoreans

Post#3 » Sat Sep 04, 2004 4:42 pm

It does show that the wars did not end with the fall of Sauron, however.


:deal: And those seeds of ill will that were spread by :badsmiley: Melkor, and :soangry: Sauron after him, live on in the hearts of Men, even unto this day. :verysad:
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valedhelgwath
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Black Numenoreans

Post#4 » Sun Sep 05, 2004 2:18 am

And those seeds of ill will that were spread by Melkor, and Sauron after him, live on in the hearts of Men, even unto this day.


This is a legacy of what is known as Morgoth's Ring. Unlike Sauron who concentrated his power into one small, but very powerful ring, Morgoth disseminated his own power over the whole of Middle Earth. In order to be able to control the hearts and minds of men he corrupted the very flesh they were made from by corrupting every single piece of matter in Middle Earth. This is also why elves grow weary in Middle Earth and begin to fade.

The Black Numenorians, by the way, were not just centered in Umbar either. They had settlements all around the coasts of southern Middle Earth, and possibly into the East too. Umbar was mainly a problem for Gondor, however, because of the Kin-Strife civil war. When the exciled Gondorian King, Eldacar returned with an army and slew the usurper Castamir, Castamir's son fled to Umbar with the entire Gondorian fleet. These folk then either allied themselves with or siezed Umbar from the Black Numenorians and became the Corsairs of Umbar. They were not actually Black Numenorians themselves, but pure blooded Gondorians who had been unhappy that Eldarcar's father had taken a Rohirrim bride and diluted the bloodline. Their hatred for Gondor did run deep though, and they persistantly raided Gondor's coasts between TA 1448 and 1810. In TA 1810 King Telumehtar Umbardacil managed to take Umbar and had the last descendants of Castamir killed. Shortly after this Umbar fell to the men of Harad, who themselves quickly became the new Corsairs of Umbar. It is these men, therefore, who Aragorn was fighting against; Haradrim/Gondorian hybrids not Black Numenorians.

melian
Posts: 167

Black Numenoreans

Post#5 » Sun Sep 05, 2004 2:10 pm

This is just something I have always been unclear about. Black Numenoreans were so called because of their preference to serve Sauron and were actually from Numenor. I know that I have read somewhere that their decendants lasted through the third age, but who were they? Did they become a seperate race?

melian
Posts: 167

Black Numenoreans

Post#6 » Wed Sep 08, 2004 12:55 pm

This is a legacy of what is known as Morgoth's Ring. Unlike Sauron who concentrated his power into one small, but very powerful ring, Morgoth disseminated his own power over the whole of Middle Earth. In order to be able to control the hearts and minds of men he corrupted the very flesh they were made from by corrupting every single piece of matter in Middle Earth. This is also why elves grow weary in Middle Earth and begin to fade.


This makes so much sense Val. I have not attempted the HOME yet, but now I see what a valuable resource they are. In the Silmarillion it is easy to see how Morgoth was a master of corruption of the minds of men and elves, but the legacy of Morgoth's Ring is indeed subtle and shows his pure hatred toward all things created by Eru.

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valedhelgwath
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Black Numenoreans

Post#7 » Wed Sep 08, 2004 2:25 pm

This makes so much sense Val. I have not attempted the HOME yet, but now I see what a valuable resource they are. In the Silmarillion it is easy to see how Morgoth was a master of corruption of the minds of men and elves, but the legacy of Morgoth's Ring is indeed subtle and shows his pure hatred toward all things created by Eru.


It is unfortunate that this piece of information is missing from the Silmarillion really, because you see Morgoth losing his power and becoming earthbound with no real adequate explaination for it. I used to think it was due to him trying to control the minds of his subject orcs, but the explaination in HOME really shows how powerful he must have been in the beginning to spread himself so far. So much is documented about Sauron's Ring, and nothing about Morgoth's.

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bugyfeanor
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Black Numenoreans

Post#8 » Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:07 pm

Indeed... And while Sauron's Ring was destroyed, Morgoth's will not be until the Breaking of Arda in the Dagor Dagorath (The Battle of Battles), when Arda shall be Remade, to the joy of all free peoples of Middle-earth (I hope...)
Evil may yet be good to have been ... and yet remain evil. (Silmarillion)

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virumor
Posts: 3567

Black Numenoreans

Post#9 » Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:12 pm

Sauron also used his power to inspire any of his followers who were originated by Morgoth. It looks like he constantly reminded them that they hated the light and all creatures of light and that they had to destroy all of them. As soon as Sauron was destroyed though, his armies lost their inspiration and just became a scary mob of pathetic lowlifes who promptly fled to their dark holes.

Of course, the Easterlings and Haradrim weren't under such influence. Sauron promising them more Lebensraum, wealth and domination over the Peoples they were learnt to hate were enough for them. After Sauron was destroyed, they kept on fighting Gondor and Gondor's allies because Morgoth had also brought those "Dark People" under his influence in the First Age.
Give up the Halfring, she-elf...

gargamel
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Black Numenoreans

Post#10 » Wed Dec 15, 2004 5:28 am

I seem to recall that the mouth of sauron was a black numorian and that the people as a whole integrated with (or became) the corsairs.

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