The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

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ammornil
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#1 » Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:34 pm


In Atlas of ME it is referred as Tranduil's Caverns. I do not hold a copy of the Hobbit around now, but I cannot recall some other name of it.


Nolwe ar alcar >> Wisdom and Glory! Wisdom is in words, Glory- in deeds.
All of this is personal opinion and understanding. For your own opinion read the books written by J. R. R. Tolkien.

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galin
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#2 » Tue Feb 08, 2011 10:44 pm


I don't remember a name at the moment anyway... if there's no known name, Bilbo maybe just left it out of his account! 



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brego
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#3 » Wed Feb 09, 2011 2:20 pm


Does anyone know if Thranduil's abode have a name. I dont mean the region Greenwood The Great, his actual cave system. Ive looked everywhere... Got me puzzled as it would be the only structure in the Tolkien universe not to have a name.



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brego
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#4 » Tue Feb 15, 2011 9:56 pm


I still cant find a reference anywhere!!!  Its a mystery....



gildor
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#5 » Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:42 am


I have not been able to find a name either. May I suggest the name Thrandolin.



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brego
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#6 » Mon Sep 26, 2011 6:24 pm


Nice Gildor!  This is very puzzling as Tolkien always without exception named his important dwellings.



Lets start a naming comp.  Name Thranduil's Hall!



gildor
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#7 » Tue Sep 27, 2011 6:08 am


Ok. Well I would vote my name in. “Thrandolin.” It is not that unusual, given that there was a great Elven city named Gondolin in the past ages of ME.



 



I am very interested in the North Eastern ME regions. Particularly the Lands stretching from the Anduin eastwards through northern Mirkwood , Thranduil’s Halls, Dale the Lonely Mountain and much more. Not much info is given as to this regions part in the War of the Ring. Given in the appendix.  However  there is room for much speculation and imagination.



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galin
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#8 » Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:57 am


The name Gondolin hails from Quenya Ondolinde, but the Sindarin form was probably interpreted as gond-dolen 'Hidden Rock' -- sort of a folk etymology according to JRRT.



*Dolengroth 'Hidden delving' (primary stress dolEngroth) might work -- based on Menegroth, which halls and rooms arguably influenced Thranduil's halls in any case. The sound -g- appears to be retained in compounds after -n-, although I can't recall a certain instance with -gr- myself.



I would prefer the adjective follow the noun in any case. Perhaps (to try a different route) *Tauroth 'Forest-delving' might be better -- or *Tawaroth, considering Tolkien's attested Tawarwaith 'Forest people' (Silvan Elves) in Unfinished Tales (tawar + gwaith).



 



For me *Thrandolin sounds nice enough, but seems a bit arbitrary with respect to meaning.



Anyway welcome Gildor! And sorry to 'disagree' a bit with your suggestion, especially so soon after you arrived. Obviously my suggestions (even if correct enough) aren't written in stone in any case.



 



Pun intended



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galin
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#9 » Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:04 am


Very kind of you sir! thanks!



I wonder if Tolkien had continued on with the '1960 Hobbit' if he would have added a name for Thranduil's halls -- JRRT only got a little way into the revision when someone gave him advice that seemingly caused him to abandon it -- but with even that much he had added a name for Gandalf's horse, for example.



 



Tolkien loved inventing names, so I'm guessing he 'would have' named Thranduil's abode -- but with emphasis on guessing!



gildor
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The Name Of Thranduil's Halls

Post#10 » Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:12 am


No not at all..... I agree with you.  You are obviously very knowledgeable about Tolkien"s writing form and attention to linguistic detail. Looking at names and naming I can see Thrandolin being too superficial or Obvious. I wonder if Thranduil was the type of leader who would promote himself that way?  It is strange that the author did not name the Halls.



To continue... I like the sound or feel of Dolengroth but were the Halls actually excavated? In my lofty opinion I believe them to be part of a limestone cave system. So perhaps Tawaroth would be better. I read somewhere that the Elves of Mirkwood were allied quite closely to the Dwarves and Men of Dale and that they had the good fortune of Dwarves actually building or working in their Halls....



Written in stone.... Ha! Ha! If Dwarves were busy there perhaps there is a name chiseled into the rock..


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