Thread: The Sniper
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Well we caught the sniper(thank goodness!) What do you all think?
YES! VICTORY IS OURS< THE SNIPER IS DEAD
Now if only the hostages in the Russian theatre can be saved with no loss of life. My God, these are "interesting times".
Now if only the hostages in the Russian theatre can be saved with no loss of life.
The terrorists said that they'll let them go only if the president announces the end of war with Chechnya. If not, they're gonna start shooting the hostages at 6 a.m. today (Saturday).
Those godd*m terrorists!
(I was born in Moscow and I love that place... you have no idea how mad I am... so I'm just following the news really closely here in New York.)
(Why isn't there a crying smiley?)
But at least the terrorists didn't get what they wanted.
[Edited on 26/10/2002 by Eryan]
Yet the innocent are always the victims. Why why why?
But at least the terrorists didn't get what they wanted.
I hope that was Ironic, I know terrorists should not be given into, but when you balance it up against all the lives lost, sometimes maybe a bit of concession isn't such a bad thing?
Anywho, terrorism should NEVER work, even a little, because if it does, we'll have even more crawling out of the woodwork.
I know terrorists should not be given into, but when you balance it up against all the lives lost, sometimes maybe a bit of concession isn't such a bad thing?
A little bit of concession? They were asking for the Russian troops to leave Chechnya and to end the war. But of course, 117 people died... oh, the horror ... Why does such terrible stuff happen?
Terrorists: If you give in --> encourages others --> even more people die
You cannot afford to give in to terrorists, misguided, brainwashed, ignorant, insane or otherwise.
They didnt even bother to tell the local hospitals and so forth how to treat them, only to expect them....
I dont have the answer to what they could have done instead.. but surely poisioning hostages wasn't the best idea... and they did poison them.. as evident by over 100 dead.. thats not an alergic reaction....
as for the sniper, I dont believe in the death penalty, but surely the police could have accidently blown the car away right???? Maybe they will accidently forget their bullet proof vests, and will accidently release the exact time and place for transporting them.... Then a nice citizen could accidently show them how it feels to have a hole blown through your chest.....
[Edited on 30/10/2002 by gimli_axe_wielder]
Still, they should have told the hospitals the name and nature of the gas, and have had more anti-toxin, medics, and ambulances standing by. I think the 600 survivors should thank God for their lives. And everybody else in Russia should lean on their government officials to be less secretive, even though secretiveness is in the Russian genes.
(Sorry for this stereotyping.)
It makes me sick that even though 700 people were saved over 100 had to die. It's not what I would call a victory over terrorism. But don't get me wrong I am glad that no more died in this event. It just seems that we never win and civilians are always dying.
[Edited on 30/10/2002 by raptor]
I know the russians were taking their stand against terrorism and all but come on!!! What did they think was going to happen when they go pumping gas into a building??
I'm sorry, but what else could they do? If they didn't do something the terrorists would've shot all 700 hostages.
Anilorak is right:
Even though my heart goes out to the innocent Russian civilians who died, I think the Russians were right in putting their foot down and not letting terrorism prevail.
I just wish the people who preach to these gullible young people and encourage them to become martyrs, would be the next people to fly a plane into a building. Once those cancankerous old gits had successfully martyred themselves, maybe the trouble would stop. Until these mindwashing religious zealots are stopped, there will never be an end to the present troubles.
If these b*****ds want a war, give them one. And don't do it with one hand tied behind your back. Nuke the bloody lot of them. I know the arguement against this is that millions of innocent people would die. But how can any citizen in such a country call themself innocent when they allow their leaders to behave in such a way. Okay, it cannot be easy to rise up against a military dictator, but if I read things correctly, it was the people of Afganistan that rose up against the Taliban. Civil war is a nasty and bloody business, but if you allow your leaders to commit atrocities in your nation's name and do nothing about it, you are not exactly innocent yourself.
Such tinpot dictators maintain their rule through terror tacticts. I'd hate to be in a situation where I had to live under such a leadership, and would be terrified of sticking my neck out, but they only maintain control by suppressing the masses. If the entire populace were to rise up against them, they'd soon be out. So if it comes to war, and people start complaining about innocent victims, don't forget anyone who lets someone else get away with such acts is himself an accomplice. If your leader provokes a situation in which you are liable to get nuked, either stand with him or stand against him.
I can't agree with a large part of the views put forward by you, but I am too tired today to write why! Perhaps I will return to this matter later on...
*being deliberately antagonistic again*
[Edited on 1/11/2002 by Stonehelm]
As much as I'm refreshed by your 'Nuke Them' policy
It's just the way that the world seems to be toitering on the verge of destruction at the moment. I feel sure that within the next ten years something terrible is going to kick off, and if it does, everyone will have to decide which side they want to be on. What I was trying to say was, if the s**t does hit the fan, it is going to effect everyone and there is going to be a lot of suffering. There must be a lot of people in the Middle East who don't want to get dragged into this conflict by their leaders, get bombed and lose their homes and families. If so, they should make their choices now.
I'm not saying we in the West are right (the fact we are more concerned about oil than lives stinks for starters), but that is the side I am on. Wars are nasty affairs, but if you are willing to kill and maim people in the first place, why make the pretence of doing it with a surgeons precision. We may have the technology to fly a cruise missile along a street and hit a specific building (and how loud are the cries condemning the death of a civilian when one does happen to miss), but did the terrorists believe they were hitting a military target on September 11th. War is nasty... Why play to one set of rules when your enemy doesn't.
If it does come to war, and I really hope it doesn't, I'd rather our leaders use our military potential (ie. whatever weapons we have in our arsenals) and get the d****d thing over with quickly. I'm sure the Japanese would have preferred to make the American's fight for every inch of soil they took at the end of WWII, but they weren't given the opportunity. Having a nuclear bomb explode over your city must be terrible, and I know all about the lasting damage it causes, but fuel/air mixtures and good old TNT aren't very nice either.
Before these terrorists try poking the West with their sticks again, they should be made aware of what they might wake up.
but why should we give up our friendship with Israel just because some little petty desert king doesn't like it? I mean, they have no right to kill us just because we don't think like them.
There's a bit more to it than that, some of the atrocities carried out by the Israelis when they TOOK Palestine away from it's natives are really very gruesome. And whose idea was it to give Israel back to the Jews? Hmmm... lets think now, and how much help and support did they then give to the Palestinians (who they promised a great deal too) during this difficult time, **** all, that's what. And that's why the Palestinians aren't too keen on the Americans in general.
THIS IS NOT A SLUR ON YOU AMERICANS AND YOUR COUNTRY/WAY OF LIFE, IT'S JUST A HISTORICAL FACT THAT GETS BLURRED OVER ALL TOO OFTEN. NO OFFENCE IS INTENDED.
I would, however, like to clarify the chain of events that led to the birth of Israel as we know it today.
It all started waaaay back in the late 1800's with the Zionist movement. European Jews began emigrating to Palestine around 1870 (I think...around there). In the late 1890's a bunch of Zionists got together and decided that the Jews, hopefully with some help from Turkey, should have their own homeland. Over the years, more and more Jews immigrated to Palestine from Europe.
During WWI, When the Ottoman Empire collapsed, Palestine came under British rule and the British decided that, yes, the Jews deserved a homeland and that Britain would help establish it (it was called the Balfour Declaration, or something like that). Jewish immigration went way up and the Arabs, needless to say, got P.O.ed, and things got really ugly...
Jump forward to WWII. The Palestinian Jews, of course, supported the war effort of allied nations which, boys being boys, meant that the Anti Zionists supported the Nazi's. At least, they didn't see anything wrong with killing Jews in large numbers... At that point, Britain limited the number of Jews immigrating to Palestine to 2,000 a month.
That's when THE JEWISH LEADERS THEMSELVES went to the United Nations and said, in a nutshell, "We want a country of our own!" A UN Special Committee recommended that, since the Jews were already there, under their own power mind you, that Palestine should be divided into Jewish and Arab sectors. The United Nations adopted the recommendation, the British packed up and left, and in 1948, with the votes of many nations, the US and Britain included, the independent state of Isreal was born, and the middle east hasn't seen peace since. America and Britain have been Israel's greatest allies ever since.
And I shall refrain from giving my opinion on any of it because that's what always gets me in trouble...
like me I won't go to Heaven nor to Hell I'll just die and end exsisting eventually my corpse will be rotted away and only a stone will remind some people I have roamed the earth.
And someone who believes in Heaven and Hell will go to his/her Heaven or Hell
The best I can see is for old Jerusalem to be a open city administered by the UN and a ruling body made up of the three religions. The two independent Nations of Israel and Palestine can each call it their capitol city. Of course for this to happen, the Jews will have to give up their West Bank settlements; Hamas and a couple other terrorist organizations will have to give up trying to push Israel into the Mediterranean; Sharon, Netanyahu and Arafat will have to be permanently replaced; and Hell will have to freeze over.
I am not trying to start any fights with anyone Ok? This is just the way I see it.
many terrorists claim that they r fightin a jehad, a holy war. but other followers of Islam say that fightin is not supported in their religion! that shows us that the leaders of many of these Mid. East countries r basically startin their own religion and brainwashin their pple 2 beleive it. i dont support terrorists and i do think we should go over there and nuke the place, but 1st i believe we should give them all a chance 2 leave and start over in a diff. country, not necessarily America.
Some idiot threw a deffensive grenade in front of a highschool in our capital city and 3 or 4 girls are in the hospital one step to death.
I can't belive what happenes these days in this f__ __ __ _world...
Some idiot threw a deffensive grenade in front of a highschool in our capital city and 3 or 4 girls are in the hospital one step to death
I am so sorry Raptor.
At least we have one up on them: When a terrorist thinks that he has arrived in paradise, and is surrounded by his awaiting allotment of virgins, we can all laugh knowing he is actually in hell, and knowing that each of those surrounding beautiful demons bears the mother of all social diseases.
Eternity in hell is a very long time, doubly so lacking a source of an antibiotic.
For what i've seen and heared till now,I think hell is up here.I am so sick of this pathetic,meaningless,cruel and twisted world!....
I will answer you by a quote from the "Silmarillion", a fragment of the song sang by Beren when parting on his hopeless errand...
Though all to ruin fell the world
and were dissolved and backward hurled
unmade into the old abyss,
yet were its making good, for this -
the dusk, the dawn, the earth, the sea -
that Luthien for a time should be
And yet another quote, this time from FOTR:
"I have never been out of my land before. And if I had known what the world outside was like, I don't think I should have had the heart to leave it"
"Not even to see fair Lothlorien?" said Haldir "The world is indeed full of peril, and in it there are many dark places; but still there is much that is fair; and though in all lands love is now mingled with grief, it grows perhaps the greater
This world, our world, is inhabited not only by evil, cruel, heartless, selfish, twisted men... but also by many beautiful people, noble, heroic, benevolent, ready to self-sacrifice, intelligent, creative... Let us not forget that when all seems hopeless!
She said to me, even now, there is hope left, but I cannot see it.
Neither can I.
[Edited on 9/11/2002 by raptor]
My heart and thoughts go out to all those people who are less fortunate, and whose lives are full of anguish, pain, hunger and suffering. i hope one day that the world sorts itself out and such miseries are a thing of the past.
ME was no paradise either and many of his heroes felt hopelessly miserable and caged... Some of them even finished by committing suicide, especially during the First Age, when the war against Morgoth was hopeless. Rian, Hurin, Turin... Aand even in the Third Age there was so much of misery and hopelessness. Exiled dwarves (Thorin & Comp.) during many years were very poor and had to work in coal mines. In Rohan Eowyn hated her life so much that she could not sleep... And even proud princes were not free from grief. Boromir and Faramir were half-orphans, they had lost their mother when still very young. And the mother of Elladan and Elrohirwas captured and tormented by the Orcs... The world created by Tolkien is not really different from ours in that respect...
As for beauty, I have seen in this here world some breathtakingly beautiful places which left me wonderful memories... Some of these places were close to Cluj Raptor!
killin defenseless pple will prove nothin! those that r killin others r just afraid 2 target sum1 w/ a gun!
Erm... what precisely do you mean?