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That's not as shocking as some of the younger dwarves, mind you. Some of them even shave their legs!!! Gasp!
Ha Ha Ha Smilie But do you, Gimli? Very Big Grin Smilie
ROFL! Ha Ha Ha Smilie
shaving legs???? how dare you reveal that.. thats a closly guarded Dwarven secret...

Why do you think it is that you never see dwarves with shorts on!
of course..

im wearing shorts right now...
And they are cosier than kilts. Very Big Grin Smilie
not as much draft! dont like the chafing of my.............


[Edited on 3/7/2002 by gimli_axe_wielder]
Very Big Grin Smilie
of course i should watch what clothing i say here.... i will get myself in trouble once again with the british meanings! Smoke Smilie
i will get myself in trouble once again with the british meanings!

Do the British have meanings? I never knew that, let alone what they are. Tongue Smilie
oh do they ever have meanings!!!! and you wanna hear something really strange.... they use Jam... not jelly!! AND!!!!!!!! they dont mix it with Peanut Butter!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Can you imagine! NO P&J Sandwiches!!!
bloody colonials........ Wink Smilie
Very Big Grin Smilie
Where do they get the nerve??
Big Laugh Smilie
Peanut Butter and Jelly (JAM You fools, we invented the d@mn language you know?) is a foul idea, but as the inventor of the Peanut Butter and Marmite Sandwich I can't really talk. Is it true that you americans don't have crunchy Peanut Butter? Man that would suck, the smooth stuff is grim.
what new found responsibility????

and we have crunchy and smooth!
actually... you didn't invent the language.. english is a corruption of other languages (just ask JRRT)

BUT there is a difference between jelly and Jam
Jelly has no pieces of fruit and made from the juice and jam is made from whole fruit and almost always has pieces and since marmalades are made from peels and the juice, they are neither jelly or jam... Grape jelly is always made from the juice... so if we were talking about PB and Grap jelly - the term is correct, but you can call all spreads "preserves" if they are canned.... My son will only eat Jelly - he detests jams -

Now you know more about home preserves than you ever wanted to know - never say you can't learn anything from a hosuewife Big Smile Smilie
Big Laugh Smilie heh! That'll teach me!
I used to help my gran make marmalades when I was a lad, always wondered what the difference was...
But enough of preserved fruit products, what of Gimli (wow, he is taking this new found responsibility seriously isn't he? Wink Smilie )
what new found responsibility????
The SKWRL's now a member of 'The Council' Smile Smilie

Jelly is clear made from juice.
Jam has fruit pulp and seeds.
Preserves has whole or bits of fruit.
Marbleblade has bits of rhyme in l'orange Jell-O.

Peanerbucker (either creamy or crunchy) with strawberry preserves, 'tween two slabs of most any kind of bread, makes the bestest d*mn sammidge there is, for being comfort food.
ah yes.. sorry, when he said gimli i was thinking me gimli.. not the thread gimli! we are a little off topic arent we...

well in that case... Personaly i wonder what became of he and Galadriel when they both left middle earth.. I mean clearly he had a thing for her.. but do you think it was mutual.. i kinda doubt it... but what do you think.. It was a major thing for him to be allowed to come.. would they allow him to persue Galadriel????
I took a peanut-butter-and-raspberry-jelly ( jelly not jam) sandwich to school for lunch every single day since kindergarten. I was thinking about it the other day, and that is a completely ridiculous number of PB&J sandwiches...never lost their charm though Big Smile Smilie

anyway, back to the whole being-on-topic thing...I definitely don't think the feeling between Galadriel and Gimli was mutual...the Elves respected him for being a pretty cool guy (for a Dwarf Wink Smilie) but I don't think they would ever let him chase after Galadriel.
poor poor gimli.....
Well at least not with Celeborn still in the picture. However if Gimli tried to take him out the picture i'm sure Jessica Fletcher Elf would have uncovered the plot and would result in either the withering of Valinor or Gimli's expulsion. So I think if Gimli wanted to pursue Gladdy's nedin he would have to be very subtle about it. I never reckoned Elves were much good as lovers. Dwarves on the other hand.....think about it, all that beard to hang onto Tongue Smilie
Gimli and Galadriel getting it on! D'you think he'd use a stepladder like the legendary Casanunder?
Sorry people, but I dont think Gimli's "appreciation" for Galadriel was a romantic thing. More like reverance as Christians revere the Virgin Mary.

And I definately think some of the feeling was returned, if in a different form. Galadriel did give Gimli some of her hair, a request that she had denied Feanor. (apparently he gave her the creeps). She must also have favoured Gimli to obtain for him the grace to come to the Undying Lands.
It was the sweetness of his tongue, Saruman couldn't hold a candle to Gimli for sweet-talking. Why Gimli could sweet-talk the spots off a leopard, the stripes of a tiger, some hair off an elderly grandmother, a cave off the Rohirrim, and a visa off the Valor. He was a real smoothie and then some. Very Big Grin Smilie
Isn't he just gorgeous? Kiss Smilie In Love Smilie I Love You Smilie

Wink Smilie
You guys are refering to me and not the character in the book right........

Big Laugh Smilie
Isn't he just gorgeous?

Are you Gimli? Is there a photo of yourself in your website?
no im not... me funny lookin... um.. lets see.... there are some at my msn site..


[Edited on 12/7/2002 by Allyssa]
Hmmmm...I wonder what dwarves eat...maybe peanut butter and JELLY.

[Edited on 25/8/2002 by Shieldmaiden]
...I wonder what dwarves eat...
You can tell just by looking at their beards. Big Laugh Smilie

You can tell just by looking at their beards

ewwww, gross! Shocked Smilie
I'd rather just read a list of their favorite foods. Read Smilie
Malt Beer and red meat on the bone.......

and P&J sandwiches Tongue Smilie
I like Gimli too. I really liked the scene when he asks for her hair. and i loved the goofy game he played with L. about killing the orcs. that was great.
Agreed! I've always found the bits where Legolas & Gimli grew closer v. touching & inspiring.

and P&J sandwiches

Now there's a person seriously pissed of with Peter Jackson. Shocked Smilie

Oh, I see. You said P&J, not PJ. Drat.
The best scene with Gimli in the movie I still think is the one on the bride of Khazad-Dum, you know: "No tossing with dwarves" or sth like that. And the one in the woods of Lothlorien. Big Laugh Smilie

But in the book it's certainly the Orc thingie. And of course I'm with Golly and Mellie here again. Smoke Smilie
Gimli has tons of great lines!!!!!!! Why, I could smell a dwarf at somethinganother paces!

blew that line didnt I.. im gonna have to watch the movie again....
'The dwarf breathes so loud we could have shot him in the dark...'
Big Laugh Smilie
Very Big Grin Smilie

Right, that's it, thanks Prog. In the movie, Gimli's certainly the one with the best lines. Big Laugh Smilie
Gimli is the comic relief i think.. just like in the books to an extent he is as well.... Part of why I love him.. He fits my personality... i am Exactly like gimli!!!
You lucky devil! Cool Smilie

But Gimli really is funny. Not so much in the book as in the film, but still... You need sb you can laugh at. Big Smile Smilie
Or laugh with, which is more fun for everybody. Elf Winking Smilie
I was going to start a Gimli thread but found the existing one instead, and I read all the posts so I have a few things to say...you are probably not surprised!

FIRST THINGS FIRST THOUGH. Peanut butter and MARMITE sandwiches? MY GOD! I'm American but I used to nanny for a guy who's father was British so he shared the whole Marmite experience with me. I found it disgusting. Is that the kind of stuff you Brits eat? If so, I'm not so sure that I want a British boyfriend anymore.

Now. Dwarf talk. Maybe it's just because I'm not through the book yet but I'm having trouble getting what Gimli is contributing to the effort of getting the Ring to Mordor.

I am aware that Tolkien needed to include a dwarf in the fellowship, to show the inclusiveness of all the peoples of middle earth against evil...to put the dwarves on the GOOD side, so to speak, and also to emphasize the teamwork aspect of things by having Gimli and Legolas set aside the conflict between their people and become friends. Fair enough, someone needed to represent the Dwarves.

But so far, everyone else on the quest has had something to DO, and what they are doing is something that only one of their kind can do, something where...if that person's skill wasn't present in the fellowship the mission would have fallen apart. For example, Frodo is the Ring Bearer. Gandalf has the magic and also navigates with Aragorn, a Ranger. Aragorn is the lead fighter. Legolas is a good moderator with the elves in Lithlorian, and his keen eyesight and hearing make him helpful, as well as being a good fighter. Boromir...well, we wonder what good he is, that's probably why he gets bumped off in the first book. The hobbits are along for the ride for a few reasons: loyalty to Frodo, follow-through of the conspiracy they formed before Frodo ever left the Shire and they each end up doing some interesting things in TTT. And then there is Gimli, what was his role in the Fellowship?

If anything, I would have thought that Gimli would show some leadership in Moria. HIS TURF. But he didn't. Don't get me wrong, I don't dislike Gimli at all, I just wonder what he is bringing to the table on this little hike. He is funny and I think it's sweet that he is so captured by Galadriel. But what does he represent about dwarves that was essential to the mission?

I would like to point out that the members of the fellowship of the ring were not chosen but they volunteered.Basically, Gimli was a fighter and a great help in fistering good ties with the elves and as a representitive of th Dwarves And to tell you the truth I like Gimli too!
Gimli was always my favorite character in the LotR, and I've always been a fan of dwarves (since having the hobbit read to me by my dad when I was very small, probably). I think he's a great member of the fellowship, especially in the fighting, and the TT was all about him and Legolas and Aragorn showing the world that they are three of the greatest heros in ME. I mean, if they had cought those orcs, man, those orcs would have been in BIG trouble... Wink Smilie And remember, he wins his game with Legolas at Helm's Deep, and he didn't have a bow to give him a head-start!

Still, people have mentioned the dwarves in the Hobbit as being a cold and calculating, and I admit, that's what Tolkien says and it's how they behave--certainly how Thorin behaves after Smaug dies. I like to point out, though, that the Hobbit might not be as accurate a source, because it's written to make Bilbo a hero, and the dwarves do a lot of bumbling along the way just so Bilbo can save them. I mean, Gandalf seems to be an old friend of Thorin and his father, so they can't be such a bad lot. And I never got the "malt beer and red meat off the bone" thing from Tolkiens works, that seems more a later development (D&D) to me. Gimli in the movie is much more D&D than Tolkien's originals, I think, who are quite cultured and reserved (the Dwarves in Hobbit all play instruments, and most of them are kind to Bilbo--Balin is a good counter example to Thorin). The reason he seems exceptional for a dwarf (though, no doubt, he is) is that everyone is still thinking of the stereotypes about dwarves perpetuated since Tolkien, since Tolkien didn't write enough about dwarves to really fill in all the gaps. I mean, where did the Scottish-Dwarf thing start? I'll have to research some passages sometime to get a better feel for what I mean. I've done some thinking on my webpage...
It was Gimli's puppy love of Galadriel that gave both he and she a little more depth of character, such that it softened him and showed her as being a little less haughty than before. For me it made Gimli into a lovable character rather than a short axe wielding lump of stone.
I still don't quite get it. To mention bravery and spunkiness is almost a given...I mean, it's fair to say that all of the Fellowship are in unfamiliar territory, whether or not we are talking about geography...and facing things that they have never dealt with in such combination or magnitude. And Gimli is brave and spunky, no doubt but not any moreso than anyone else. He has a "whup some butt and take some names" attitude but he doesn't really take the lead in that in a rallying sort of way, he's merely kind of a yes man, along for the ride. I'm just wondering if Gimli will bring something to the fellowship that will really save the day, where he is the only one who can step forward and say...Well, I'm a dwarf and so I know something about this...here is what we should do.

As for the contest that he had with Legolas, I confess I'm not there in the book yet. Did that even happen in the book? When I saw the movie, I was on the lookout for smarmy PJ/hollywood embellishments and the whole skateboarding Legolas, Gimli the jester, and that contest at helm's deep seemed like something that did NOT come out of the book. I do recognize from both book and movie that Gimli and Legolas are becoming closer as friends. This is wonderful and probably a big part of Gimli getting more comfortable and skilled with things that dwarves don't usually do, such as riding horses. But that still doesn't answer my question about what heroic skill or characteristic that Gimli's dwarfness essential to the mission. I was really thinking that Gimli would step up in Moria but with that whole finding the crypt of his dead relative, he was made again...vulnerable, not in the position of leadership. And then Gandalf died, and kind of stole whatever sunshine Gimli may have had on his own turf.

For example, we know that Frodo as a hobbit, is the only one humble, innocent, etc enough to carry the ring. Aragorn with his Ranger skill, brings both navigation and fighting skills...and as an heir of kings, he seems to have a knack for leadership in Gandalf's absence...I said all this before. But so far the only dwarfy thing that I have noticed Gimli do is p*** off the trees with his axe, in every forest they went through and cause tension (not his fault) when they came into elf territory (thinking of the blindfold part). The others keep having to smooth over for him without ever making up for it...know what I mean? The spunkiness is probably very dwarfy but it doesn't seem unique enough.

Let's say for the sake of argument, Gimli and Legolas are fighting side by side in a battle. They are looking out for each other as only friends can do. Let's say...that for a split second Legolas, very UN-ELF-LY doesn't see something coming and GIMLI bails out Legolas by using his very dwarfy axe to kill someone who is going after Legolas...NOW SOMETHING LIKE THAT WOULD answer the question. OR IF Gimli had been able to point them down the right hallways in Moria, because he had heard the dwarves sing about them and he knew which way was safe. See what I mean?

I don't mean to be p***y or anything, maybe I'm a little dense on this, or maybe there is not really a good answer to the question...or maybe I just haven't gotten there in the story yet. I don't mean to sound harsh about Gimli but I don't think so far he is pulling his weight.

Re: the selected vs volunteer thing? that was not my point, what I meant was that they all found themselves on this quest and I would have expected that Tolkien put them all there for a reason...that they all would serve a different purpose, their unique experiences as members of a certain race, or as individuals...would have been useful....blahblahblah...I do confess that regarding Boromir, I pretty much considered him dead weight as well. He didn't represent anything but weakness to me.

[Edited on 9/2/2003 by Allyssa]
Gimli was a fighter and a great help in fostering good ties with the elves

I can be so stupid sometimes...I wasn't listening obviously.

Are you trying to say, everyone, that Gimli was pretty much along for the ride to "be himself" and prove himself to all of us, both readers and others in the story??

I think I see where it would have been worthwhile for Gimli to be on the mission if he forever changed the elves' minds about dwarves...in that way Tolkien may have set the groundwork for telling us how different things will be when this whole Ring thing is over with.

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